Today we are here with Giovanni Zavaglia, a young man who caught our attention because of his passion for good food, local ingredients and his knowledge of the world of BBQ. Giovanni bakes perfect, eye-catching focaccia. We met through a Facebook page full of colours and flavours that we recommend.

His passion for cooking arose out of necessity when he was a child. His mother worked as a factory worker and he prepared lunch for both of them after school. Over time, cooking became a passion, a way to take his mind off everyday life.

He got to know Gabriele Bonci through a work colleague and from there he also began to develop a passion for baking.

Then, more recently, he had a motorbike accident. Managing his new normal was not easy and so food and photography were supportive enough to bring out the colours and vibrancy of his simple yet sophisticated dishes.

Giovanni still remembers that mystical brisket, the 25-hour smoked beef brisket that made him fall in love with the barbecue. Then the trips to Austin, to Franklin’s, a concentration of wonders…

But let’s get down to business and delve a little deeper into the subject.

Tell us about the tricks for grilling in a healthy, tasty and social way?

I wish there were some easy tricks for learning how to barbecue quickly. There are no tricks of the trade that I feel like sharing. And I hope I don’t disappoint anyone.

In barbecue, but more generally in cooking, you need patience and a lot of experimentation. I heard Mauro Finco say that cooking is “a personal laboratory” and that’s been ringing in my head ever since. A trick, if you like, is to know the device you have in front of you and that you use to cook.

How does the heat rise?

How much heat is transmitted to the dish you are cooking?

In addition, the results are not immediately obvious: the meat initially dries out or burns. What’s more, the marinade is often wrong…

What would you recommend to a person approaching BBQ for the first time?

Be humble. After any BBQ course, you can’t expect to know everything about BBQ. I think that wanting to learn is the most important thing. And if someone gives you advice, take it: generally those who give you advice do it to help you improve whatever you’re preparing. I’m still learning today. And I am willing to exchange ideas.

Also, you follow people like Marco Agostini, who has been a point of reference for me. Marco is a BBQ innovator, he is the one who created the creative barbecue and many new techniques. I worked with Marco and now I collaborate in writing some articles on Barktenders in which I talk about cooking techniques for meat and bread making. He has changed my way of thinking.

Can you share some meat preparation tips with us?

Yes, of course, but what kind of meat are we talking about? We can’t generalise. If I were to think of Ghisanativa, I would imagine a nice braised meat. Shall we talk about that?

First of all, you have to have a trusted butcher’s shop that serves you meat from what I call “happy farms”. So:

• choose a nice ‘shoulder of beef’;
• brown the meat;
• take it out of the cast-iron casserole dish;
• add chopped vegetables (I prefer carrots, leeks and onions) and brown them with the triple concentrated tomato sauce;
• put everything back into the casserole dish;
• cover with a good Nebbiolo wine;
• simmer over low heat until a fork penetrates without resistance (for me 94 degrees at the heart is the perfect temperature for an exceptional braise);
• blend the cooked vegetable base and reduce it by half;
• cut the braised meat into slices after it has cooled.
• Serve and enjoy.

Could you give us a recipe for one of your favourite sauces?

Well, if I think of a sauce, I would suggest my favourite one to go with Baltimore Pit Beef. But it’s also a great combination with pork cuts.

Proceed by mixing:

• 2 tablespoons of mayonnaise;
• one tablespoon Cren;
• one and a half teaspoons of Dijon mustard;
• a teaspoon of Acacia honey.

And if you had to recommend a few tools of the trade, what would you suggest?

Certainly, you need a kettle-style grill with a lid to make different types of preparation: they range from the Italian-style live grill to the American-style barbecue with indirect cooking. I now use the kamado, a family of devices conceptually derived from a Japanese-style grill. Here you don’t use briquettes but hardwood charcoal.

You need good cast iron pots and pans and I am now using Ghisanativa. In particular, I like the way the heat is evenly distributed much better than on other cast iron hotplates. The price is justified not only because it is made entirely in Italy but also because of the taste that is transferred directly to the piece of meat achieving an almost immediate and perfect Maillard. What’s more, cooking on a pan that has no glazes, silicones or anything else makes me feel comfortable enjoying the taste of the food.

The cooking temperature of food is crucial. So you need a thermometer to penetrate the food to the core and detect the temperature of the meat.

• High-quality charcoal
• Tongs to grip all the food firmly

Two good books to learn more about BBQ are written by Marco Agostini and are entitled ‘Subito barbecue’ and ‘Universo barbecue’. In my opinion, you need to study and get lots of practice.

And if you had to recommend a few tools of the trade, what would you suggest?

Certainly, you need a kettle-style grill with a lid to make different types of preparation: they range from the Italian-style live grill to the American-style barbecue with indirect cooking. I now use the kamado, a family of devices conceptually derived from a Japanese-style grill. Here you don’t use briquettes but hardwood charcoal.

You need good cast iron pots and pans and I am now using Ghisanativa. In particular, I like the way the heat is evenly distributed much better than on other cast iron hotplates. The price is justified not only because it is made entirely in Italy but also because of the taste that is transferred directly to the piece of meat achieving an almost immediate and perfect Maillard. What’s more, cooking on a pan that has no glazes, silicones or anything else makes me feel comfortable enjoying the taste of the food.

The cooking temperature of food is crucial. So you need a thermometer to penetrate the food to the core and detect the temperature of the meat.

High-quality charcoal.

Tongs to grip all the food firmly.

Two good books to learn more about BBQ are written by Marco Agostini and are entitled ‘Subito barbecue’ and ‘Universo barbecue’. In my opinion, you need to study and get lots of practice.

How does the Italian BBQ world differ from that in the USA? What are the latest BBQ trends for barbecue experts?

First of all, let’s start with the concept that BBQ is often confused with grilling. True American-style barbecue is not about steaks, burgers, hot dogs but about huge quantities of meat, often whole animals, cooked very slowly using wood that makes smoke. The trinity of BBQ traditionally consists of brisket, pulled pork, and ribs.

For a long time, when people talked about Italian BBQ they meant – to give an example – ribs ‘burnt’ on the outside and raw on the inside in direct cooking.

Let’s take a step back and quickly explain the difference between direct and indirect cooking for newbies. In direct cooking, the coals are positioned underneath, in direct correspondence with the heat source. Cooking takes place by radiation and conduction, and its most evident manifestation lies in the intense, fragrant, and tasty level of cauterization and in particular in the so-called grill marks, the lines of micro-burning resulting from contact with the grill.

On the other hand, in indirect cooking, the coals accumulate on only one-half of the grill, and the food is placed on the opposite side of the grill from them, in the unavoidable presence of the lid.

In practice, from burnt ribs in direct cooking, we have moved to ‘low slow’, that is, cooking over low heat and at low temperatures, an American-style cooking process. The meat is rubbed with spices on the surfaces (rub) and the mix creates a new material called ‘barque’. The carbon monoxide binds to the proteins in the meat and makes it fragrant and crispy.

There is now a trend towards a creative BBQ where anything can be cooked on the BBQ and smoked. Most grillers are trying to give their own twist to traditional Italian and international recipes.

There is constant research into new cooking techniques such as ‘flash roasting’. Flash roasting means cooking a piece of meat at a temperature of 140 – 150°C up to the point where the meat is 10 degrees below the target temperature. At this point, the meat is taken off the hotplate. It is brushed with a softened butter flavoured with spices. Then it is cooked again at 200 degrees until the target temperature is reached.

This is a technique used on beef to achieve a fragrant, spicy crust and even internal cooking.

Giovanni Zavaglia